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	<title>Comments on: Fortune: Price-to-Rent Correction Forecasting</title>
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	<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/</link>
	<description>News &#38; discussion about real estate &#38; the housing bubble in the Seattle area.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 10:02:55 -0800</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Angie</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29518</link>
		<dc:creator>Angie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 17:31:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29518</guid>
		<description>Tim linked to the Fortune article in today&#039;s (11/8) post. Since the discussion there is trending toward his media appearances (looking forward to checking them out later!), I thought I&#039;d weigh in about the article in question in this venue...

The prediction from that article is, indeed, over a 5 year range. Their oracle predicts that house prices will fall ~20% over the next five years---AND, rather less easy to find among the numbers, that rents will rise that same amount in the next five years. 

If that does come to pass, I still maintain that Seattle will *still* be an unaffordable place to live. 

That $500K median SFH in the city will drop to $400K--but unless the median city income rockets up to $133K (from its current $70K for a family of 4, $56K for single people), that&#039;s still unaffordable by traditional lending limits of borrowing 3X income. 

And the upward pressure on rents will make it harder for renters to get by, and for those who want to buy, to save for those down payments...

In sum--I don&#039;t think this is the kind of good news that you bubble dudes think it is.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29518&#039;,&#039;Angie&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29518&#039;,&#039;Angie&#039;,&#039;Tim linked to the Fortune article in today\&#039;s (11\/8) post. Since the discussion there is trending toward his media appearances (looking forward to checking them out later!), I thought I\&#039;d weigh in about the article in question in this venue...\r\n\r\nThe prediction from that article is, indeed, over a 5 year range. Their oracle predicts that house prices will fall ~20% over the next five years---AND, rather less easy to find among the numbers, that rents will rise that same amount in the next five years. \r\n\r\nIf that does come to pass, I still maintain that Seattle will *still* be an unaffordable place to live. \r\n\r\nThat $500K median SFH in the city will drop to $400K--but unless the median city income rockets up to $133K (from its current $70K for a family of 4, $56K for single people), that\&#039;s still unaffordable by traditional lending limits of borrowing 3X income. \r\n\r\nAnd the upward pressure on rents will make it harder for renters to get by, and for those who want to buy, to save for those down payments...\r\n\r\nIn sum--I don\&#039;t think this is the kind of good news that you bubble dudes think it is.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim linked to the Fortune article in today&#8217;s (11/8) post. Since the discussion there is trending toward his media appearances (looking forward to checking them out later!), I thought I&#8217;d weigh in about the article in question in this venue&#8230;</p>
<p>The prediction from that article is, indeed, over a 5 year range. Their oracle predicts that house prices will fall ~20% over the next five years&#8212;AND, rather less easy to find among the numbers, that rents will rise that same amount in the next five years. </p>
<p>If that does come to pass, I still maintain that Seattle will *still* be an unaffordable place to live. </p>
<p>That $500K median SFH in the city will drop to $400K&#8211;but unless the median city income rockets up to $133K (from its current $70K for a family of 4, $56K for single people), that&#8217;s still unaffordable by traditional lending limits of borrowing 3X income. </p>
<p>And the upward pressure on rents will make it harder for renters to get by, and for those who want to buy, to save for those down payments&#8230;</p>
<p>In sum&#8211;I don&#8217;t think this is the kind of good news that you bubble dudes think it is.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29518','Angie',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29518','Angie','Tim linked to the Fortune article in today\'s (11\/8) post. Since the discussion there is trending toward his media appearances (looking forward to checking them out later!), I thought I\'d weigh in about the article in question in this venue...\r\n\r\nThe prediction from that article is, indeed, over a 5 year range. Their oracle predicts that house prices will fall ~20% over the next five years---AND, rather less easy to find among the numbers, that rents will rise that same amount in the next five years. \r\n\r\nIf that does come to pass, I still maintain that Seattle will *still* be an unaffordable place to live. \r\n\r\nThat $500K median SFH in the city will drop to $400K--but unless the median city income rockets up to $133K (from its current $70K for a family of 4, $56K for single people), that\'s still unaffordable by traditional lending limits of borrowing 3X income. \r\n\r\nAnd the upward pressure on rents will make it harder for renters to get by, and for those who want to buy, to save for those down payments...\r\n\r\nIn sum--I don\'t think this is the kind of good news that you bubble dudes think it is.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: Seattle Bubble &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Welcome KING 5 Viewers!</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29498</link>
		<dc:creator>Seattle Bubble &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Welcome KING 5 Viewers!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 15:04:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29498</guid>
		<description>[...] Fortune: Price-to-Rent Correction Forecasting [...]&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29498&#039;,&#039;Seattle Bubble &raquo; Blog Archive &raquo; Welcome KING 5 Viewers!&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29498&#039;,&#039;Seattle Bubble &raquo; Blog Archive &raquo; Welcome KING 5 Viewers!&#039;,&#039;&#91;...&#93; Fortune: Price-to-Rent Correction Forecasting &#91;...&#93;&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Fortune: Price-to-Rent Correction Forecasting [...]
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29498','Seattle Bubble &amp;raquo; Blog Archive &amp;raquo; Welcome KING 5 Viewers!',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29498','Seattle Bubble &amp;raquo; Blog Archive &amp;raquo; Welcome KING 5 Viewers!','&amp;#91;...&amp;#93; Fortune: Price-to-Rent Correction Forecasting &amp;#91;...&amp;#93;',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: TheDexter</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29270</link>
		<dc:creator>TheDexter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Nov 2007 10:07:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29270</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s nice to live in a town where it&#039;s still possible to rent a waterfront property on Alki / Beach Drive SW for $1,150.00 a month, for a location worth just under two million dollars. Will it last for the renter? No. For the owner? Come on now.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29270&#039;,&#039;TheDexter&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29270&#039;,&#039;TheDexter&#039;,&#039;It\&#039;s nice to live in a town where it\&#039;s still possible to rent a waterfront property on Alki \/ Beach Drive SW for $1,150.00 a month, for a location worth just under two million dollars. Will it last for the renter? No. For the owner? Come on now.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s nice to live in a town where it&#8217;s still possible to rent a waterfront property on Alki / Beach Drive SW for $1,150.00 a month, for a location worth just under two million dollars. Will it last for the renter? No. For the owner? Come on now.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29270','TheDexter',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29270','TheDexter','It\'s nice to live in a town where it\'s still possible to rent a waterfront property on Alki \/ Beach Drive SW for $1,150.00 a month, for a location worth just under two million dollars. Will it last for the renter? No. For the owner? Come on now.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: Ira Sacharoff</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29261</link>
		<dc:creator>Ira Sacharoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Nov 2007 06:38:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29261</guid>
		<description>Not sure if I agree with George about it still being a good time to sell. It would be a good time to sell if there weren&#039;t so many properties on the market, and if things were selling. Inventory is up, sales are down. Good time to sell if you can sell.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29261&#039;,&#039;Ira Sacharoff&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29261&#039;,&#039;Ira Sacharoff&#039;,&#039;Not sure if I agree with George about it still being a good time to sell. It would be a good time to sell if there weren\&#039;t so many properties on the market, and if things were selling. Inventory is up, sales are down. Good time to sell if you can sell.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure if I agree with George about it still being a good time to sell. It would be a good time to sell if there weren&#8217;t so many properties on the market, and if things were selling. Inventory is up, sales are down. Good time to sell if you can sell.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29261','Ira Sacharoff',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29261','Ira Sacharoff','Not sure if I agree with George about it still being a good time to sell. It would be a good time to sell if there weren\'t so many properties on the market, and if things were selling. Inventory is up, sales are down. Good time to sell if you can sell.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: george</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29240</link>
		<dc:creator>george</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Nov 2007 02:07:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29240</guid>
		<description>Although it&#039;s probably too optimistic if housing tips us into a recession, that article just confirms the obvious. 

It&#039;s a lousy time to buy. Renting isn&#039;t a bad option.  It&#039;s also still a good time to sell.  Unless you want to hang on forever, or want to chase a falling market down the rabbit hole.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29240&#039;,&#039;george&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29240&#039;,&#039;george&#039;,&#039;Although it\&#039;s probably too optimistic if housing tips us into a recession, that article just confirms the obvious. \r\n\r\nIt\&#039;s a lousy time to buy. Renting isn\&#039;t a bad option.  It\&#039;s also still a good time to sell.  Unless you want to hang on forever, or want to chase a falling market down the rabbit hole.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although it&#8217;s probably too optimistic if housing tips us into a recession, that article just confirms the obvious. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s a lousy time to buy. Renting isn&#8217;t a bad option.  It&#8217;s also still a good time to sell.  Unless you want to hang on forever, or want to chase a falling market down the rabbit hole.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29240','george',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29240','george','Although it\'s probably too optimistic if housing tips us into a recession, that article just confirms the obvious. \r\n\r\nIt\'s a lousy time to buy. Renting isn\'t a bad option.  It\'s also still a good time to sell.  Unless you want to hang on forever, or want to chase a falling market down the rabbit hole.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: Matt Goyer</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29232</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Goyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:55:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29232</guid>
		<description>You can read the article online at: http://mag1.olivesoftware.com/ActiveMagazine/welcome/Time/Fortune/TFM-12-November-2007SGRVPS.asp

Flip to page 77.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29232&#039;,&#039;Matt Goyer&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29232&#039;,&#039;Matt Goyer&#039;,&#039;You can read the article online at: http:\/\/mag1.olivesoftware.com\/ActiveMagazine\/welcome\/Time\/Fortune\/TFM-12-November-2007SGRVPS.asp\r\n\r\nFlip to page 77.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You can read the article online at: <a href="http://mag1.olivesoftware.com/ActiveMagazine/welcome/Time/Fortune/TFM-12-November-2007SGRVPS.asp" rel="nofollow">http://mag1.olivesoftware.com/ActiveMagazine/welcome/Time/Fortune/TFM-12-November-2007SGRVPS.asp</a></p>
<p>Flip to page 77.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29232','Matt Goyer',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29232','Matt Goyer','You can read the article online at: http:\/\/mag1.olivesoftware.com\/ActiveMagazine\/welcome\/Time\/Fortune\/TFM-12-November-2007SGRVPS.asp\r\n\r\nFlip to page 77.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: rose-colored-ghoulaid</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29230</link>
		<dc:creator>rose-colored-ghoulaid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:42:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29230</guid>
		<description>Bold to predict 5 years out?  I&#039;d call it canny.  When asking for research grants, it&#039;s important to make predictions which are far enough out that nobody is really expecting results, but close enough to feel meaningful.  That&#039;s why all research will &#039;come to market in 5-15 years&#039;.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29230&#039;,&#039;rose-colored-ghoulaid&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29230&#039;,&#039;rose-colored-ghoulaid&#039;,&#039;Bold to predict 5 years out?  I\&#039;d call it canny.  When asking for research grants, it\&#039;s important to make predictions which are far enough out that nobody is really expecting results, but close enough to feel meaningful.  That\&#039;s why all research will \&#039;come to market in 5-15 years\&#039;.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bold to predict 5 years out?  I&#8217;d call it canny.  When asking for research grants, it&#8217;s important to make predictions which are far enough out that nobody is really expecting results, but close enough to feel meaningful.  That&#8217;s why all research will &#8216;come to market in 5-15 years&#8217;.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29230','rose-colored-ghoulaid',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29230','rose-colored-ghoulaid','Bold to predict 5 years out?  I\'d call it canny.  When asking for research grants, it\'s important to make predictions which are far enough out that nobody is really expecting results, but close enough to feel meaningful.  That\'s why all research will \'come to market in 5-15 years\'.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: TJ_98370</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29225</link>
		<dc:creator>TJ_98370</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 22:05:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29225</guid>
		<description>Sorry Tim - Way off topic, but I could not resist posting this priceless find. 

&lt;i&gt;Hundreds of thousands of people, including the author, have sold their homes under the patronage of St. Joseph, whose intercession they sought after burying his statue in their yard......&lt;/i&gt;

&lt;a href=&quot;http://stjosephstatue.com/kit.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Underground Real Estate Agent Kit&lt;/a&gt;&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29225&#039;,&#039;TJ_98370&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29225&#039;,&#039;TJ_98370&#039;,&#039;Sorry Tim - Way off topic, but I could not resist posting this priceless find. \r\n\r\n&lt;i&gt;Hundreds of thousands of people, including the author, have sold their homes under the patronage of St. Joseph, whose intercession they sought after burying his statue in their yard......&lt;\/i&gt;\r\n\r\n&lt;a href=\&quot;http:\/\/stjosephstatue.com\/kit.htm\&quot; rel=\&quot;nofollow\&quot;&gt;Underground Real Estate Agent Kit&lt;\/a&gt;&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry Tim &#8211; Way off topic, but I could not resist posting this priceless find. </p>
<p><i>Hundreds of thousands of people, including the author, have sold their homes under the patronage of St. Joseph, whose intercession they sought after burying his statue in their yard&#8230;&#8230;</i></p>
<p><a href="http://stjosephstatue.com/kit.htm" rel="nofollow">Underground Real Estate Agent Kit</a>
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29225','TJ_98370',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29225','TJ_98370','Sorry Tim - Way off topic, but I could not resist posting this priceless find. \r\n\r\n&lt;i&gt;Hundreds of thousands of people, including the author, have sold their homes under the patronage of St. Joseph, whose intercession they sought after burying his statue in their yard......&lt;\/i&gt;\r\n\r\n&lt;a href=\&quot;http:\/\/stjosephstatue.com\/kit.htm\&quot; rel=\&quot;nofollow\&quot;&gt;Underground Real Estate Agent Kit&lt;\/a&gt;',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: softwarengineer</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29224</link>
		<dc:creator>softwarengineer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 22:04:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29224</guid>
		<description>THERE&#039;S A LIMIT TO ALL RENTS IN SEATTLE

It seems to be about $2000/mo right now, if it gets higher than this the rentor market totally dries up or is too intermittant and short-term. Also, the rentors become buyers.

What does that mean? Irrespective of the statistical tool used to predict rents, with stagnating household incomes in America and Seattle, there&#039;s a dollar limit the landlord can get.

Will household average incomes rise in Seattle in the next few years? Doubtful, unless new domestic technologies emerge creating unique domestic job growth, something we haven&#039;t seen in decades with this outsourcing phenomena.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29224&#039;,&#039;softwarengineer&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29224&#039;,&#039;softwarengineer&#039;,&#039;THERE\&#039;S A LIMIT TO ALL RENTS IN SEATTLE\r\n\r\nIt seems to be about $2000\/mo right now, if it gets higher than this the rentor market totally dries up or is too intermittant and short-term. Also, the rentors become buyers.\r\n\r\nWhat does that mean? Irrespective of the statistical tool used to predict rents, with stagnating household incomes in America and Seattle, there\&#039;s a dollar limit the landlord can get.\r\n\r\nWill household average incomes rise in Seattle in the next few years? Doubtful, unless new domestic technologies emerge creating unique domestic job growth, something we haven\&#039;t seen in decades with this outsourcing phenomena.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>THERE&#8217;S A LIMIT TO ALL RENTS IN SEATTLE</p>
<p>It seems to be about $2000/mo right now, if it gets higher than this the rentor market totally dries up or is too intermittant and short-term. Also, the rentors become buyers.</p>
<p>What does that mean? Irrespective of the statistical tool used to predict rents, with stagnating household incomes in America and Seattle, there&#8217;s a dollar limit the landlord can get.</p>
<p>Will household average incomes rise in Seattle in the next few years? Doubtful, unless new domestic technologies emerge creating unique domestic job growth, something we haven&#8217;t seen in decades with this outsourcing phenomena.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29224','softwarengineer',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29224','softwarengineer','THERE\'S A LIMIT TO ALL RENTS IN SEATTLE\r\n\r\nIt seems to be about $2000\/mo right now, if it gets higher than this the rentor market totally dries up or is too intermittant and short-term. Also, the rentors become buyers.\r\n\r\nWhat does that mean? Irrespective of the statistical tool used to predict rents, with stagnating household incomes in America and Seattle, there\'s a dollar limit the landlord can get.\r\n\r\nWill household average incomes rise in Seattle in the next few years? Doubtful, unless new domestic technologies emerge creating unique domestic job growth, something we haven\'t seen in decades with this outsourcing phenomena.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: on topic</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29223</link>
		<dc:creator>on topic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 21:55:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29223</guid>
		<description>sure, 5 yrs is a long way out, but they are talking about a ratio more than absolute values. it is pretty reasonable to assume that any external force (in terms of wars, general economic troubles, etc) will work on rents and house prices in roughly the same way.

only differentiating forces, like changes in interest rates, will change the cost ratio of renting vs owning.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29223&#039;,&#039;on topic&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29223&#039;,&#039;on topic&#039;,&#039;sure, 5 yrs is a long way out, but they are talking about a ratio more than absolute values. it is pretty reasonable to assume that any external force (in terms of wars, general economic troubles, etc) will work on rents and house prices in roughly the same way.\r\n\r\nonly differentiating forces, like changes in interest rates, will change the cost ratio of renting vs owning.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sure, 5 yrs is a long way out, but they are talking about a ratio more than absolute values. it is pretty reasonable to assume that any external force (in terms of wars, general economic troubles, etc) will work on rents and house prices in roughly the same way.</p>
<p>only differentiating forces, like changes in interest rates, will change the cost ratio of renting vs owning.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29223','on topic',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29223','on topic','sure, 5 yrs is a long way out, but they are talking about a ratio more than absolute values. it is pretty reasonable to assume that any external force (in terms of wars, general economic troubles, etc) will work on rents and house prices in roughly the same way.\r\n\r\nonly differentiating forces, like changes in interest rates, will change the cost ratio of renting vs owning.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: Geordie Romer</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29218</link>
		<dc:creator>Geordie Romer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 21:24:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29218</guid>
		<description>I think it is bold for Fortune to do a 5 year forecast. I thought it was an interesting article with a new spin, but I&#039;m doubtful of their predictions.  I try not to predict past 6-12 months - anything else seems foolish. Will the Presidential election change markets? Interest rates? How about changes in lending regs? War with Iran? War between India and Pakistan? Lots can happen in 5 years.

When 5 years is up, what will Fortune say? &quot;Well, there was a fundamental shift that no one could have foreseen..&quot; Of course there was, that&#039;s why such predictions are so tough.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29218&#039;,&#039;Geordie Romer&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29218&#039;,&#039;Geordie Romer&#039;,&#039;I think it is bold for Fortune to do a 5 year forecast. I thought it was an interesting article with a new spin, but I\&#039;m doubtful of their predictions.  I try not to predict past 6-12 months - anything else seems foolish. Will the Presidential election change markets? Interest rates? How about changes in lending regs? War with Iran? War between India and Pakistan? Lots can happen in 5 years.\r\n\r\nWhen 5 years is up, what will Fortune say? \&quot;Well, there was a fundamental shift that no one could have foreseen..\&quot; Of course there was, that\&#039;s why such predictions are so tough.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it is bold for Fortune to do a 5 year forecast. I thought it was an interesting article with a new spin, but I&#8217;m doubtful of their predictions.  I try not to predict past 6-12 months &#8211; anything else seems foolish. Will the Presidential election change markets? Interest rates? How about changes in lending regs? War with Iran? War between India and Pakistan? Lots can happen in 5 years.</p>
<p>When 5 years is up, what will Fortune say? &#8220;Well, there was a fundamental shift that no one could have foreseen..&#8221; Of course there was, that&#8217;s why such predictions are so tough.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29218','Geordie Romer',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29218','Geordie Romer','I think it is bold for Fortune to do a 5 year forecast. I thought it was an interesting article with a new spin, but I\'m doubtful of their predictions.  I try not to predict past 6-12 months - anything else seems foolish. Will the Presidential election change markets? Interest rates? How about changes in lending regs? War with Iran? War between India and Pakistan? Lots can happen in 5 years.\r\n\r\nWhen 5 years is up, what will Fortune say? \&quot;Well, there was a fundamental shift that no one could have foreseen..\&quot; Of course there was, that\'s why such predictions are so tough.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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		<title>By: on topic</title>
		<link>http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29209</link>
		<dc:creator>on topic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Nov 2007 20:44:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://seattlebubble.com/blog/2007/11/05/fortune-price-to-rent-correction-forecasting/#comment-29209</guid>
		<description>conceptually, this seems pretty reasonable, but just like there was a speculative premium when the market had had several years of impressive growth, people will expect to pay less than the 23X multiplier because the market will have had negative growth years.

either that, or Seattle has changed as a market and is no longer the Seattle of 15 years ago, so it will move to whatever multiplier is more appropriate for a more prominent city.&lt;div class=&quot;comment-remix-meta&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;replyto&quot; onclick=&quot;replyto(&#039;29209&#039;,&#039;on topic&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Reply&lt;/a&gt;  - &lt;a href=&quot;#&quot; class=&quot;quote&quot; onclick=&quot;quote(&#039;29209&#039;,&#039;on topic&#039;,&#039;conceptually, this seems pretty reasonable, but just like there was a speculative premium when the market had had several years of impressive growth, people will expect to pay less than the 23X multiplier because the market will have had negative growth years.\r\n\r\neither that, or Seattle has changed as a market and is no longer the Seattle of 15 years ago, so it will move to whatever multiplier is more appropriate for a more prominent city.&#039;,&#039;&#039;); return false;&quot;&gt;Quote&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>conceptually, this seems pretty reasonable, but just like there was a speculative premium when the market had had several years of impressive growth, people will expect to pay less than the 23X multiplier because the market will have had negative growth years.</p>
<p>either that, or Seattle has changed as a market and is no longer the Seattle of 15 years ago, so it will move to whatever multiplier is more appropriate for a more prominent city.
<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('29209','on topic',''); return false;">Reply</a>  &#8211; <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('29209','on topic','conceptually, this seems pretty reasonable, but just like there was a speculative premium when the market had had several years of impressive growth, people will expect to pay less than the 23X multiplier because the market will have had negative growth years.\r\n\r\neither that, or Seattle has changed as a market and is no longer the Seattle of 15 years ago, so it will move to whatever multiplier is more appropriate for a more prominent city.',''); return false;">Quote</a></div>
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