I defer to George Carlin: “It’s called the Amercian Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it.”

I don’t care how low the rates go as a potiental buyer. If it’s still way overvalued, I won’t catch a falling knife. Prices have a ways to go, downwards. I don’t live in a world of simultanious Hope and Denial. Relying on one or the other never proves wise.

Here are some tax rates:

1. Haiti – 40.1%
2. Sudan – 31.6%
3. Congo – 65.5%

1. Sweden – 54.5
2. Luxemburg – 21.0
3. Japan – 55.4

source: http://www.doingbusiness.org/ExploreTopics/PayingTaxes/Details.aspx?economyid=98

While the rates are comparable, companies benefit from a lot better infrastructure in the developed countries. This makes the net cost of operating lower. So while taxes that are efficiently spent are beneficial, it is the core services that benefit the economy. The rest must be relentlessly trimmed so that don’t breed dependence and become a drag on society.

Here is a list of places where most of the population pays no tax:
1. Haiti
2. Sudan
3. Congo

These countries are also fully deregulated and very lax firearm controls.

Here are countries with higher tax rates:
1. Sweden
2. Luxemburg
3. Japan

Seattle off 1.4% M2M, 9.8% Y2Y, 10.1% off of peak

Even Obama knows you can’t add taxes to Detroit or Citi Bank, etc….who’s left? Boeing and Microsoft, etc? Even Obama knows if you tax our companies, they pass on the costs by increasing layoffs.

So who does that leave to pay the bailout mess interest? Look in the mirror.

I estimate all our net pay, if we’re lucky enough to have jobs in 2009, will be cut like 20-30%. This will cause even more home price deflation, it has to.

I am tired of hearing people claim this. One common theme of these people who make idiotic financial decisions is that it’s not their fault, they were just doing what they were supposed to do.

These people get into trouble because they let others make decisions for them, instead of activating their intellect and choosing for themselves. Unfortunately many, including the government, see these people as victims, and so kindly offer our money to allow them to continue to make stupid choices.

My understanding is that banks generally wait until an offer has been submitted before they determine what they’re willing to accept. When a short sale property enters the market, the listing agent has to generate an offer and present that to the bank – then, the bank will either accept, reject or counter.

I agree it is a bit misleading to offer a property at a price that the seller may not be able to sell at, but that’s how it is for now. The listing agent has to pick a price that is likely to generate an offer and the bank may be willing ot accept. If the two are far apart, the agent needs to err towards the former.

Why don’t we just call their bluff and nationalize the banking system.

Isn’t that pretty much what is happening already? The Citigroup deal is yet another nail in the coffin of private banking, as the government takes recieves equity in exchange for capital. Without government help Citigroup is insolvent. The $1.2 trillion Citigroup holds off-balance sheet has decline so much in value that the instution would be in violation of reserve requirements if it were forced to properly mark to market.

Unfortunately, each bailout the government makes only puts more pressure on the remaining institutions which haven’t yet been “helped” (i.e. since people prefer to do business with “safe” institutions backed by the government, rather than private ones with no backing). It is just a matter of time until the next domino falls.

Thanks for the info. A house I’m tracking sold for $550k in 2006. As it turns out, it was an 80/20 ARM. It’s currently listed at $370k and says nothing about it being a short sale. What’s the deal on these short sales? People list their houses for way less than they owe. But how is that possible, the bank hasn’t approved a sale for $180K less than owed? Also, isn’t it a little unethical to list a house for way less than owed and not state on the listings it’s a short sale contingent upon the bank’s approval of the amount?

Why don’t we just call their bluff and nationalize the banking system.

Wrong, they got far more money out of the house than they put into it. The lender’s loss is the borrower’s gain. What they spent the money on is irrelevant – that was their choice.

Any idea why King county pulled the records from the web Mike? Just curious.

I’m not Mike, but I can answer that. The official reason can be found here:

Deeds of trust filed in King County are no longer available online due to an ordinance passed by the King County council aimed at safeguarding personal information contained in online documents.

Apparently some people were putting SSNs on deeds of trust, so rather than go through and censor the documents with the problem, they just pulled them all offline.

This is why I love Seattlebubble so much. Always something new and fills the void in some significant way.

Any idea why King county pulled the records from the web Mike? Just curious.

King pulled all Deeds of Trust about 2 years ago – but back when you could see the terms on recent sales, it was what you’d expect for a market experiencing a housing bubble.

Ah, Tim. You beat me.

Go to your county records website. Here are the links for King, Snohomish, and Pierce. Search public records for the owner’s name (as recorded on the parcel sale) with a start date at the purchase date of the property and an end date of today.

Loan information can be found on the “DEED OF TRUST” document type. For Snohomish and Pierce, you can view these online. For King County you will need to write down the “Instrument Number” for all the documents you found on the web search and want to view and head down to the King County Recorders Office in downtown Seattle to view them.

The summary above includes all documents filed with the county by the party in question from the purchase date to the present.

Edit: I just looked up the loan info for a friend that I knew got an 80/20 back in ‘03, and indeed there are two separate deeds of trust listed with the county, one for $194,400 and a second for $48,600. So in the case described in the post above, I don’t believe there was a second 20% mortgage.

256K 1st + 64K 2nd + 32K Heloc + 1.18K refi fees rolled in = 353,180

Yes, loan amounts are available on DEED OF TRUST documents via the Snohomish County records website. However, this information is not available online for King County. To view deeds of trust in King County you must go in person to the recorder’s office.

How did you get the figure of 256K in your example? Is that information publicly available?

All I know, is I tried the link once, it popped up an error page… I went to the base address, it worked… I tried the full address again later.. and it worked.

I may have just been unlucky with the fist attempt.

That’s odd. Is anyone else having that problem? I assumed that if you hadn’t agreed to the terms it would force you to that page first.

Matt @ 3,

It’s definitely a re-fi, not a sale. Most likely yeah, there was some serious equity withdrawal going on. Possibly in the form of rolling in other debts such as credit card debt and/or car loan(s).

In this case, both parties are screwed. The lender loses money big time. Good. The homeowner loses his/her house. Brilliant. Whatever little money they put into the house has evaporated. Additionally that foreclosure stays on their credit record. I hope no one gives them a mortgage for another 15 years (should certainly be done to people who took out HELOCs like the example you have given above).

I can maybe excuse a poor first time home buyer (especially non native English speaking people) who got suckered into the American Dream. Cannot excuse people who took out HELOCs and refinanced repeatedly.

so, 256+32=288. how do you get from $288k to $353k? is the difference an equity withdrawal? was that a sale in 2005 instead of a refi?

- too dumb to figure it out, not so dumb I can’t ask stupid questions.

thanks

The house had been on the market for over a year, originally listed in 2007 at $595,000. Now listed at $310K, we offered $300K. But for various reasons, we pulled out of the offer. When I look at those HELOC numbers, I can’t help but wonder where the heck did all this money go? The house was built in 1986, as far as I could tell, there were no significant improvements made to the house..except maybe a deck and a hot tub. Where is the accountability? They get to walk away from this, whether they successfully short sell their home or forclose on it.

the direct link didn’t work for me.. I had to trim it down to the base link so I could accept the terms and conditions before the site would load.

base link http://198.238.192.100/

(note: now the I’ve accepted the terms and conditions once, the direct link appears to work)