Seattle Bubble

News & discussion about real estate & the housing bubble in the Seattle area.

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Entries Tagged as 'Gardner'

Reporting Roundup Flashback: September 2007

By The Tim on October 9th, 2009 at 9:00 AM · 33 Comments

Let’s look back a couple years to see what local real estate agents were saying a few months after the price peak in Seattle, and about a year into the housing decline across most of the rest of the country. Here’s a selection of choice quotes from some October 2007 articles. Note that local home prices are down roughly 15% ($60,000 on a $400,000 home) in the two years since these articles were published.

NWMLS press release, October 5, 2007:

Trying to time the market is “a fool’s game,” remarked one MLS director. “If you are buying a home to live in for more than three years, then buy the one you love, not the one that you can save $25,000 on,” advises Matt Deasy, general manager at Windermere Real Estate/East Inc. in Bellevue.

J. Lennox Scott, chairman and CEO of John L. Scott Real Estate said now is “an ideal time for buyers.”

“The time is right for buyers on the sidelines to step forward. They have many more home choices now than in the past few years,” observed [Windermere broker] Marcie Maxwell.

Seattle P-I, October 5, 2007:

One month of lower prices doesn’t mean much, said Glenn Crellin, director of the Washington Center for Real Estate Research at Washington State University.

“I think it is suggestive that there is some real softness in the (Seattle) market,” he said. “But at the same time, I think we’ve got a more resilient housing market than in many parts of the country.”

Matthew Gardner, a Seattle land-use economist who works with developers, does not put much weight on the Seattle median-home price, particularly because it excludes most sales of new condos, he said Friday.

Actually, year-to-year increases of about 4 percent in the median price across King County and the 19 counties in the listing service were higher than Gardner anticipated, he said. He expects a leveling off — with increases of roughly 3 percent — for a couple of years.

“We need to get through this backlog of inventory,” he said. “Also, we need to start allowing time for wages to catch up.”

Tacoma News Tribune, October 6, 2007:

Agents on Friday, however, largely portrayed Pierce County’s one-month price decline as more anomaly than trend and what’s to be expected in a market normalizing after the boom years of 2004 and 2005.

Buyers shouldn’t view one month of lower prices as a sign that more are on the way, said Bill Riley, owner of Gateway Real Estate. Riley is vice president-elect of the Washington Realtors, which plans to launch a campaign this month encouraging buyers to purchase now rather than wait.

“This is not a start of a decline. We’ve never seen a decline in such a strong fundamental market,” he said, pointing to expected job growth…

Everett Herald, October 6, 2007:

“It looks like the market has kind of taken a deep breath and just corrected itself a little bit,” said Nathan Gorton of the Snohomish County Camano Board of Realtors.

“It’s a good time to be a buyer right now.” … “I talk to a lot of buyers’ agents whose customers are saying they just want to sit back right now because they don’t think it’s a good time to buy a home,” he said. “They think, ‘Oh my gosh, the market is falling apart.’ Nothing could be further from the truth.”

For comparison, here were my comments about these stories at the time:

It will be interesting to watch the increasingly ridiculous gyrations of local real estate salespeople as the market continues its downward path, and they come up with more and more outrageous statements that fly in the face of reality. It looks like the bubble deflation show has finally rolled into town.

Indeed it has been an entertaining show, and trust me; it ain’t over yet.

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Matthew Gardner Predictions vs. Reality

By The Tim on February 2nd, 2009 at 6:00 AM · 43 Comments

Incredible. Even with the major continuing job losses and home prices in unabated decline, Matthew Gardner continues to spread the word of a recovery for Seattle in 2009.

Here are a couple of slides from a PowerPoint presentation Matthew Gardner used in a class for local real estate agents on the 19th:

Gardner 2009 Forecast

Gardner 2009 Forecast

Jobs will lead to a housing recovery in 2009? Really? And how exactly are foreclosures going to “continue to slow,” when the latest data shows that they haven’t even started to slow?

Let’s take a look at Matthew Gardner’s recent performance when it comes to accurately forecasting the local market…

2007
Gardner Forecast: Prices +5 to +9%
Case-Shiller: +0.5%
King Co. SFH: -1.1%

2008
Gardner Forecast: Prices 0 to -5%
Case-Shiller: -11.2% (Nov.)
King Co. SFH: -7.2%

Here’s a visual representation of Matthew Gardner’s predictions for 2007 and 2008 vs. the Case-Shiller index:

Matthew Gardner vs. Case-Shiller

Like I said about J. Lennox Scott and Dick Beeson: I’m not going to tell you who you should or shouldn’t trust when it comes to predictions about the local housing market, but I do think everyone should at least be equipped with all of the data when making such a decision.

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Predictions: 2008 in the Bag, 2009 on the Horizon

By The Tim on January 9th, 2009 at 11:30 AM · 52 Comments

Looking back at 2008
And now it’s the post we’ve all been waiting for (and by “we” I mean probably just me). Time to see which real estate “professionals” made housing market predictions that match closest with reality, which ones were more in line with the former Iraqi Information Minister, and what they’re all guessing for the coming year.

A year ago we rounded up 2008’s predictions into a single post: Predictions: 2007 Revisited, 2008 Prognosticated. As with last year, I’ll provide a list of the contenders, and a handly table for comparing our predictions with the reality of 2008. You can go back to the post to see the full context of all of the predictions.

The Contenders:

  • Glenn Crellin, director of the Washington Center for Real Estate Research
  • Matthew Gardner, local land-use economist
  • Steve Tytler, Everett Herald Real Estate Columnist / owner, Best Mortgage
  • Dick Conway, co-author of The Puget Sound Economic Forecaster / local economist
  • Tim Ellis, editor-in-chief, Seattle Bubble
  Crellin Gardner Tytler Conway Ellis King Co. SFH
Prices:  “a little” -5% to 0% -20% to -10% <1% -10% to -5% -7.24%

This year, the prize for the prediction closest to reality goes to… defending champion Tim Ellis of Seattle Bubble! Yet again, the total price change fell almost exactly in the middle of my range prediction.

To be fair, we are using King County SFH data as our sample set (as is standard practice on this site), while selecting different data sets makes some of the other predictions look better. For example, Steve Tytler forecast a ten to twenty percent drop for “the Puget Sound region.” If we look at all Puget Sound counties, the smallest drop was in Skagit, where prices fell 3.3%, and the largest drop was in Jefferson, where prices took a 23.6% plunge. However, that still leaves three counties (Skagit, King, and Jefferson) that were outside Steve’s range (four if we count San Juan County, where December’s median was down 45.6% from 2007, but based on just 9 sales).

On inventory, I predicted “year-over-year increases between 10% and 25% throughout much of the year.” Year-over-year inventory increases did not drop below 10% until September, so that looks like another win. My prediction on sales volume was arguably too optimistic, as I guessed they would drop “at least 5% to 15%.” Here in King County, total pending sales for the year were down 25%, while closed sales dropped 33%.

What’s ahead for 2009?
With 2008 out of the way, let’s look forward to 2009. Here’s a summary of all the predictions I was able to locate from local “professionals.”

Matthew Gardner:

Going forward, Gardner says, “we’ll be in a V-shaped year on prices.”

“The first half of the year we’ll continue to see declines,” he says. “The second half of the year we’ll start seeing a bit of an upward trend.”

In all, Gardner says, he wouldn’t be surprised if Seattle-area housing prices remain essentially flat — something that would actually be good news in some parts of the country.

Gardner qualifies his prediction in his quotes to the P-I:

Matthew Gardner, a Seattle land-use economist, said he expects prices to level off next summer, “if we see economic stimulus and further retraction in interest rates.”

Steve Tytler:

There is a fairly predictable 7- to 10-year real estate cycle and we are in the “down” part of that cycle. What makes the current cycle different is that we are entering what may turn out to be the worst national recession since the Great Depression. Now, I know that phrase is grossly overused. It seems that every few years some politician claims that the economy is the worst since the Great Depression, but this time I think it’s actually true.

I think that overall home prices will fall an average of 5 to 10 percent next year, but the depreciation rate will vary dramatically from city to city and neighborhood to neighborhood, just as we’ve seen wide variations this year.

J. Lennox Scott:

Scott thinks entry-level house prices (basically $500,000 and under in Seattle) have stabilized, so there may be no advantage to waiting.

In the mid- and upper-price ranges, “some people are waiting to see what’s happening,” Scott says, but even if those prices continue to decline, owners who sell at a reduced price also are likely to buy at a reduced price, so it’s a wash.

Looking forward, he is hopeful that the Obama administration will quickly pass a stimulus plan that will give the economy, and home sales, a boost.

More from Scott in a blog post by Aubrey Cohen:

But 2009 will be a year of “new beginnings,” Scott said. “It will also be a year of transition for the housing market, which will begin rebuilding itself starting with the more affordable price ranges.”

Unfortunately, those are the only firm predictions I could find from local “professionals.” Maybe they’re just trying to save themselves the embarrassment of being wrong yet again.

The Tim’s Predictions
My guess is that inventory in 2009 will be flat to slightly down from 2008 for most of the year. I am betting that the double-digit YOY drops in sales will not last beyond the first or second quarter, but will eventually flatten out and maybe even show YOY gains. My sales prediction is based largely on an assumption that home prices will continue to fall as well, eventually coming down to a level that is able to attract more buyers. This is what has happened in California over the last year, and I expect the trend will eventually make its way up north.

As far as a specific prediction on prices, my guess is about another 10 percent drop in 2009, which would put December 2009’s median at $363,150. My guess is that we may hit the end of the big price drops in 2010, then bob along on the bottom for a few years after that.

So there it is, your regularly scheduled doom and gloom. As always, what really happens is going to depend largely on a plethora of external factors that could go either way. Despite what so many people tried so hard to believe during the boom, Seattle is not encased in a giant glass bubble. Will Obama come riding in on a unicorn and magically save the economy? Will Boeing or Microsoft lay off tens of thousands? Does China decide to call their debts to America? Major issues like these will have big effects on our housing markets in 2009, and I’m sure whatever happens, we’ll be looking back a year from now in amazement.

What are your predictions? Let’s hammer this out in the comments. Also, here’s a poll:

What's your King County SFH median price prediction for 2009?

  • Less than -20% (5%, 31 Votes)
  • -20% to -15.1% (17%, 101 Votes)
  • -15% to -10.1% (39%, 235 Votes)
  • -10% to -5.1% (26%, 156 Votes)
  • -5% to 0% (8%, 48 Votes)
  • 0% to +5% (2%, 14 Votes)
  • +5.1% to +10% (0%, 2 Votes)
  • More than +10% (3%, 9 Votes)

Total Voters: 596

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Weekend News Roundup

By The Tim on October 27th, 2008 at 9:05 AM · 44 Comments

Wow, lots of stories in the local papers this weekend about the slow housing market. Too many to post separately, so here’s a roundup of the weekend news. Let me know if I missed anything.

Everett Herald: Snohomish County builders slash home prices

Mike Pattison just took his own advice and bought a new home in the Silver Lake area.

He bargained hard for a lower price and even convinced the builder to throw in furniture.

“I’m a believer in our message,” said Pattison, who works for the Master Builders Association of King and Snohomish Counties. “It’s a great time to buy.”

Todd Britsch also makes another appearance in this article to repeat his “double digit appreciation returning soon” prediction. Fun times.

The Olympian: Families fight bad economy: Local people downsize, rethink budgets and reduce spending

Lynette Avery and her family used to go out for dinner every Friday. They’d take turns choosing the place – Red Robin, a pizza parlor or a nother family-friendly spot.

But in May, they were forced to move out of their Bucoda home because they couldn’t afford their mortgage payment. The family settled into a Tumwater rental.

“It was devastating,” Avery said of losing her home.

While it’s certainly sad when people lose “their” homes, what is more sad to me is how many people allowed themselves to be brainwashed into thinking that jumping head-first into a dangerous loan in order to overpay for a house was more important than financial prudence and patience.

Seattle Times: Homebuilders in region hurting despite what you see

It’s hard to find physical evidence that homebuilders in the Puget Sound area are suffering through what may be the worst downturn since the 1970 Boeing bust.

Gun-shy buyers aren’t unique to the new-home market, and that’s the problem. As the mortgage industry has staggered, foreclosures have risen, and prices have dropped throughout the market. Buyers for all types of homes sit on the sidelines.

Cumulatively, all these factors are causing a major decline in new-home construction here because new-house buyers mostly are move-up buyers. If they can’t sell their present homes, they can’t move up.

Wasn’t it just a year or two ago, as the housing markets in Florida and SoCal were just starting to go bust, that we were assured that builders here had learned from the mistakes made in those markets, and would not be facing such a dramatic slowdown? I wonder what ever happened to that.

Seattle Times: Downtown slowdown: Seattle, Bellevue building projects take a hit

How many construction cranes did you count the last time you drove through downtown Seattle or downtown Bellevue? Ten? Twelve? More?

Count them while you can.

The credit crunch and related economic woes are drying up the development pipeline in the region’s two commercial hubs. More than two dozen projects are on hold, many because developers say they can’t borrow money to build.

“It’s a different world now,” says Seattle land-use economist Matthew Gardner. “The banks have shut their doors.”

Different, yes. Unforeseeable, not really. But unfortunately, gung-ho builders were only interested in listening to the rosy predictions of people like Mr. Gardner, and ended up setting themselves up for this.

Seattle Times: Prospective condo buyers in Seattle area sitting on the fence

Sometime around the end of the year, the first residents will move into Bellevue Towers, Bellevue’s tallest skyscrapers.

They may have plenty of elbow room for a while.

The twin, 42-story luxury condo towers are nearly finished. But just over one-third of the 539 units have been sold.

“We had hoped to be two-thirds sold by now,” Scott Eaton, a principal with developer Gerding Edlen, said recently. “It’s a different world.”

The financial crunch is squeezing builders of new for-sale housing of all types, including those big new condo towers rising toward the sky in downtown Seattle and downtown Bellevue. More than 2,300 condo units are under construction in the two city centers, according to figures compiled by principal Dean Jones of the condo-marketing firm Realogics. Almost all are scheduled for delivery within the next year.

So far fewer than half have been sold. In some projects barely one-quarter of the units are spoken for.

Note that this is only counting units in the “city centers.” Who knows how many more there are in the surrounding neighborhoods and towns. So either a large number of condos will be eventually converted to rentals, pumping up the rental supply, or there are going to be some crazy deals on condos in a couple of years. Either way, it looks like a win for affordable housing.

Update: One more from the Seattle Times this morning: Stalled projects, scarred neighborhoods

A crater-sized hole near Green Lake. A derelict corner in Lynnwood. A sorry shopping mall in Kirkland.

Retail development projects, slowed or stopped by a flailing economy, are revealing themselves as blights on neighborhood business districts.

You can add one in my neighborhood to that list, as the developer of the long-promised “Kenmore Village” is having trouble finding an anchor tenant and is putting off the project, waiting for the financial crisis to settle and the housing market to improve.  They could be waiting quite a while.

(Debra Smith, Everett Herald, 10.26.2008)
(Diane Huber, The Olympian, 10.26.2008)
(Elizabeth Rhodes & Stuart Eskenazi, Seattle Times, 10.26.2008)
(Eric Pryne, Seattle Times, 10.26.2008)
(Eric Pryne, Seattle Times, 10.26.2008)
(Stuart Eskenazi, Seattle Times, 10.27.2008)

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Predictions: 2007 Revisited, 2008 Prognosticated

By The Tim on January 17th, 2008 at 7:00 PM · 186 Comments

2007 Revisited
It’s that time of the year again. As the calendar rolls over, the real estate predictions start rolling in. But before we get to the predictions for 2008, let’s look back at 2007.

My own guesses as well as predictions from most of the frequently-quoted local real estate insiders were covered in this post from last January, save for Steve Tytler, whose predictions are covered here. Let’s see how we all did.

The Contenders:

  • Bill Riss, chief executive of Coldwell Banker Bain
  • Randy Bannecker, consultant housing specialist for the Seattle-King County Association of Realtors
  • Glenn Crellin, director of the Washington Center for Real Estate Research
  • Matthew Gardner, local land-use economist
  • Steve Tytler, owner, Best Mortgage
  • Tim Ellis, editor-in-chief, Seattle Bubble

You can go back to the post to see the full context of all of our predictions. However, for this post, I have condensed everyone’s predictions into a convenient table format for your convenience:

  Riss Bannecker Crellin Gardner Tytler Ellis King Co. SFH
Listings: - - - - >0% >15% +51%
Sales: 0% - <0% <0% <0% <-5 to -10% -14.5%
Prices: +10% +6 to 10% +3 to 5% +5 to 9% <=0% -5% to +3% -1.14%

And the person whose predictions most closely matched the 2007 outcome was… Tim Ellis of Seattle Bubble! Steve Tytler gets the honor of being the only other person to be at all accurate, with his generic prediction of a “big increase” in inventory and a general reduction of buyers.

Note that the final reported median price change was almost exactly in the middle of my estimated range of -5% to +3%. And although my inventory and sales forecasts were the closest of the bunch, reality was unbelievably even more extreme than my predictions. So I either got pretty darn lucky, or after one year of following the market in my spare time, I had a better sense of where it was headed than the majority of those whose very livelihood is the market.

2008 Prognosticated
So that brings us to the 2008 forecast. First up, let’s check out what some of the same local real estate insiders are guessing this year:

Glenn Crellin:

Year-to-year drops should continue “for a little while,” said Glenn Crellin, director of the Washington Center for Real Estate Research at Washington State University. “I think that the next several months are still going to be challenging, but it’s a little hard to tell,” he said, adding that he also expects interest rates to increase during most of the year, potentially wiping out any savings gained by waiting.

Glenn also made some more specific predictions for the Pierce County market in a Q&A with the Tacoma News Tribune.

Matthew Gardner:

For 2008, Gardner is predicting anywhere from zero appreciation to home prices falling as much as 5 percent. “Do I think we’re going to see pain next year? Yes, I do. If there’s some glimmer of hope, it’s the fact we didn’t get terribly overbuilt because of the expense of land,” Gardner says.

Steve Tytler:

I expect home prices to drop about 10 percent to 20 percent over the next year or so, and then the housing market will flatten out with very little appreciation or depreciation for a few years.

Dick Conway:

Conway anticipates average Puget Sound-region home prices will decline less than 1 percent next year, and sales will be down about 5 percent, before rebounding in 2008. “Given that we had a pretty good run-up in prices, some downward adjustment shouldn’t be surprising,” he says.

It would appear that after being so off base with last year’s optimistic forecasts, most of this year’s predictions are a bit more down to earth. The general concensus seems to be price declines of up to five percent. As with last year, Mr. Tytler is the most bearish of the bunch, and will probably be the most accurate as well.

The Tim’s Predictions
Personally, I’m expecting to see a continued surge in inventory, with year-over-year increases between 10% and 25% throughout much of the year. As prices stagnate and drop, the number of “must-sell” homes will only increase. Furthermore, when public sentiment shifts from “buy now or be priced out forever” to “sell now or be stuck there forever,” listings will continue to increase further.

Sales will probably continue their slide as lending standards continue to tighten (regardless of which direction interest rates go). I would guess that sales will be down at least 5% to 15%. Think of it this way: The record sales that we saw in 2005 and 2006 were basically just the housing market borrowing sales from the future. Well, the future is here, and the debt must be repaid.

I do not expect prices to drop like a rock, but I think that 5% is the minimum drop we’ll see in the median, not the maximum. I’d put the range at -5% to -10%.

So there you have it. Your doom and gloom for 2008. I may be way off base, but at least I’m willing to stick my neck out there and give it a guess. I have yet to see any signs that the market is “bottoming out” or at any kind of turning point. 2007 was the turning point, and we’re pretty plainly headed down into 2008. I don’t expect this mess to work itself out before the year is out.

What say you, the readers?

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Condo Projects Repartmenting, Rental Vacancy Increasing

By The Tim on December 11th, 2007 at 10:09 AM · 119 Comments

It looks like the picture for renters may not be quite as bleak as we have been led to believe in recent articles. Turns out that new apartments are being built, and even some condo projects are becoming apartments instead.

Apartments have been the poor stepchild to condominium towers over the past few years in downtown Seattle. They’re back in vogue now, but the national housing storm may dampen their return to prominence.

“Isn’t it always this way?” Seattle’s Dupre + Scott Apartment Advisors asked in a December report on the apartment market. “Apartment development picks up just as our economy slows down.”

Los Angeles developer Urban Partners announced Monday that it had broken ground on Aspira, a 37-story apartment tower on a former church parking lot at the southwest corner of Stewart Street and Terry Avenue. The Hanover Co., of Houston, is already building the Olivian, a 27-story luxury apartment building at Eighth Avenue and Olive Way, and several other towers are in the works.

Aspira was originally slated for condos. Julie Benezet, managing director of the Urban Partners’ Seattle office, attributed the change to a glut of announced condominium projects, skittishness among the investors who fund condo towers because of condo speculation in other parts of the country, an apartment supply that has shrunk because of a lack of new construction since the dot-com meltdown in 2001 and conversion of existing apartments to condos in recent years.

The article goes on to quote predictions (by Matthew Gardner, amazingly enough) of slowing job growth, rising vacancy rates, a “complete stop” of condo conversions, and stabilizing rents (i.e. tracking with salaries). Now where have we seen this pattern before? Hmm… Oh yeah, pretty much every other bubble city that has seen their market deflate before us.

So much for all the anti-rent scare tactics to keep up the flow of suckers buying overpriced homes.

(Aubrey Cohen, Seattle Times, 12.10.2007)

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