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Seattle Bubble Forum Archive • View topic - Debt

Debt

How will housing affect the US and world economy? How will the economy affect housing?

Moderators: synthetik, The Tim, Lake Hills Renter

Re: Debt

Postby BillE » Sat Aug 08, 2009 1:36 am

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Re: Debt

Postby davidlosh@davidlosh.com » Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:30 am

Cat converters are made with platinum. Did you know that? It's the most bizzare thing. So yes putting them in, two so far, was cheap, the cost of the unit was expensive.

I really have come to the conclusion that cars today aren't what the used to be.
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Re: Debt

Postby davidlosh@davidlosh.com » Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:52 am

Let's look at retirement. In Real estate you can retire with five housing units owned free and clear. one to live in, and four to rent out. Out of the four rentals, one should cover taxes and insurance on all units, one for living expenses, one for personal expenses, and one for savings. The cost of rents, in theory, goes up or down with inflation.

There are safe haven investments that pay a return.

You've worked hard and the money is in the bank, but you are still you. I for one continue to talk about where I can buy tomatoe product for sixty five cents a can. You can buy second hand. You can drive a clunker. I do and have done all of those things.

It seems like every body I know who has money is protecting the money more than living. There are those people in the middle who are working towards a goal of retirement with a pension plan, but that, today, seems very risky.

My observation would be that those people who risk debt to get a return seem to be a lot freer with the life style. On this blog The Tim is a play on The Donald. Donald Trump encourages leveraging. That seems risky but is there something to that?

Debt is a trap or a means to an end. Living debt free seems to be a trap also of living within our means. Are our means stifled by the fear of debt? The fear of risking debt?
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Re: Debt

Postby lamont » Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:19 am

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Re: Debt

Postby TJ_98370 » Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:36 pm

David,

I am debt free. As I work for the federal government, I have been contributing to a "mandatory" pension plan. I have a very boring investment portfolio, almost guaranteed zero loss with minimal return. I will not ever own a million dollar waterfront house, nor drive a Porsche and I am okay with that. What I do have is that I can sleep at nite, knowing that me and mine will be okay upon retirement, irregardless of what the market does.
.
I hate the risk associated with leveraging and I am willing to accept the lost opportunity of greater returns, but that's just me.
.
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Re: Debt

Postby Markor » Sat Aug 08, 2009 7:01 pm

Smart choice. A typical fed gov't job probably beats the majority of private sector jobs, when the pension and health care is factored in.
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Re: Debt

Postby TJ_98370 » Sat Aug 08, 2009 7:58 pm

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Re: Debt

Postby davidlosh@davidlosh.com » Sun Aug 09, 2009 2:13 pm

I have worked for the government and was very pleased to see how my tax dollars were being spent. Two people who I know, one in the service who is re upping, and the other enlisting, are motivated by the economy of the private sector.

My concern would be that after a life of service your retirement will look like every other day, maybe. The people I know with pensions are pretty desperate at times. The ones with investment income seem to be doing better.

My best investment story is of a guy who found an engine and spoiler of a Plymouth Road Runner in a barn and bought them for $600. He built the car around those two items and netted $54K after about two years when he sold the finished car to a guy in California.


That was a for cash project, but there are people who just trade cars they find, buy and sell. You can do that for cash.

Using other people's money seems to be a theme even in the get out of debt books that I have read. Borrow from family, or consolidate loans is a chapter or two in every book. When you talk about creating wealth it's the whole book of how you have to risk either your own money or some one else's.

Other people's money is how we got to where we are today. Is there building wealth with out risk? Can you build wealth without debt?
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Re: Debt

Postby rose-colored-coolaid » Sun Aug 09, 2009 6:46 pm

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Re: Debt

Postby Markor » Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:24 pm

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Re: Debt

Postby TJ_98370 » Sun Aug 09, 2009 9:38 pm

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Re: Debt

Postby davidlosh@davidlosh.com » Mon Aug 10, 2009 6:56 am

RCC, the guy who wouldn't let his kids go on the field trip was sticking to his principles as a life lesson for his kids. His sacrifice was for the family vacation that was in the budget. I don't have a particular judgement about that, It's more of a question if things can go too far.

Yes, you can make a million dollars without incurring debt, you're just not saying how. Let me say this about being frugal and delayed gratification; it's a sacrifice.

Today debt is all around us, it's every where, every body owes money, I'll bet the person on the corner with a shopping cart has debt or is on the corner because of debt. Everybody got multiple credit cards, second mortgage, consolidation loans, OK, you get the idea.

What I'm not saying is that you are going to die. You have a limited time on this earth. Cancer can strike at any time. It happened to my second wife.

There must be a balance between living in fear of debt and living. Why is there such a wide canyon that some people can cross and others just look over the edge?
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Re: Debt

Postby TJ_98370 » Mon Aug 10, 2009 7:53 am

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Re: Debt

Postby rose-colored-coolaid » Mon Aug 10, 2009 10:53 am

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Re: Debt

Postby Markor » Mon Aug 10, 2009 11:39 am

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